There is nothing I can disagree with there…

Your words on LF: “With Fischer alone, our preseason ranking would be much higher…” sounds fairly definitive to me. I wasn’t belittling his potential so much as remarking that IMO he did not have or demonstrate the skills needed to be a front court difference maker in the B1G. Apparently you saw things from his brief time on the court that I missed, and that’s just fine w/me! Using your same line of thinking, I might submit that HMP could make a big impact on this year’s team as well–but that’s just wishful guesswork at this point, right?

You either misread or misunderstood my very 1st sentence. No where did I say anything re: how Izzo & Beilein’s respective teams would turn out this year; I’m not really concerned w/what happens in East Lansing (except on 5 Jan) or Ann Arbor. I asked how you thought that Cal, “K” Pitino,… etc got to be and stay among the best and most successful coaches in college. With the possible exception of Bill Self, every one of those named has had a “down season” or two. But they were able to overcome that by adapting to the changing natures of the game, players and recruiting.

Comments on whether bigs or shooters were the staff’s priority in the 2014 class are academic at this point. He did address a couple deficiencies which the 2013-14 team had (shooters & chemistry). This will be another squad that has been 100% recruited and coached by TC. Recall that the folks @ ESPN didn’t think highly enough of his overall abilities to make it into their Top 50 list. Maybe this is the year he’ll be able to prove them wrong…I hope so!

As for Fischer, I said COULD have – not definitive. He had the tool set. You obviously have watched some ball over the years, so to belittle his potential is kinda lame IMO. Numbers aren’t everything for freshman. Do they hustle? Are they putting themselves in good position? Are they taking care of the ball/rebounding? etc…

I find it pretty funny that you include Beilein and Izzo who’s teams will likely have weaker-to-comparable front courts to IU this season… I don’t know enough about the other said coaches rosters to discuss and don’t care to look into it. But it took me only a few moments to find 2 poor examples in the list.

You are correct that CTC did go after some bigs, but it was not a priority. Also, having NV, LF and HP as freshman/sophomores isn’t necessarily that attractive for recruits. He tried some things late after LF departed, followed by NV in March. But the volume of available players was slim and competition was rough. I thought we would land Anthony Lee, but OSU swooped him up before we got our visit…

How in the world do you think Calipari, “K”, Pitino, Self, Izzo, Donovan, Boeheim, Ryan, Williams, Beilein, Matta, Wright, Fisher, Smart, Dixon, Altman, Few (that enough names for you?) got to be and stay among the best and most successful coaches in college? You can call it a “speculative post presented as fact” or some other catchy phrase, but it doesn’t change the point that elite coaches anticipate losses of key players and take applicable/appropriate pro-active (as opposed to reactive) measures. It seems like every year, Calipari, “K”, Self &, Pitino lose 2 or more guys to the draft, and each of them goes right out and gets pretty good quality ballers to replace them. Same can be said to a lesser degree about every other one of the above-named coaches. There may be a surprise exit (grades, NBA, transfers) on occasion, but these guys have found a formula (24/7/365 staff recruiting) that perhaps isn’t understood or followed by their less-successful peers.
“CTC was using that time to address our glaring need – not courting front court players.” Isn’t this also a classic instance of “speculation being presented as fact’? The lack of consistent, effective outside shooting was a major problem, but turnovers exacerbated the woes of last year’s team as well. I seem to want to recall that CTC extended offers to a variety of bigs–all of whom signed elsewhere, and to his credit, I believe that TC was tying to prepare for what eventually happened –long before Fischer, Hollowell and Vonleh left B’town. With a nearly bare cupboard due to early signings, I don’t recall EVER hearing CTC talk about going after any JUCO players although there were some attractive candidates out there: Steven Hurt-KState; Cinmeon Bowers-Auburn; Michael Chandler-Oregon; Willie Atwood-ASU; and, Shane Henry-Va Tech among others. Not saying that the JUCO route is the way to go, but it worked once for us in 1987. It is pointless to try to determine why IU wasn’t successful signing any of the premier bigs. Same as it is to “speculate” that IU would have been rated higher if Fischer had not left. In the 10 minutes/game over 13 games he played, his stats were slightly better than Jeff Howard’s but less than HMP’s numbers even though he played more min/game than Hanner. Yeah, I submit that we’re really going to miss his 3 rebounds and 2 points a game…he was destined to be a real difference-maker. NOT.

If anyone were to “cite the names of 10-15 coaches who would have anticipated rather than reacted to their player losses” it would be pure speculation – which is the entire reason for this little back-n-forth thread. A speculative post presented as fact.

A good amount of 2014 kids had decided on their college choice before the 2013 season began. So I’d love to hear how those other 10-15 coaches would have anticipated the sudden front court need, when Fischer didn’t leave til Christmas and Volneh bounced in March.

Our lack of shooting ability was the biggest issue that needed addressed with the 2014 recruiting class. Recruiting takes time spent on relationship building. CTC was using that time to address our glaring need – not courting front court players.

Fischer was injured over the summer going into the season, he played in 13 games and progressively earned more time on the floor. 10 min/game over those 13 games gave us a good enough look to know that he could have made a big impact on this years team.

As you said, life goes on. CTC took a chance at some last second options and the options were few. Time will tell if that will pay off.

Perhaps no one could have predicted those departures, but I would guess that most who post on here could cite the names of 10-15 coaches who would have anticipated rather than reacted to their player losses. It’s part of a process they follow which keeps their programs in the “elite” class.
No one will ever know how Fisher would have impacted our program. He may have gotten injured (Jurkin), been a divisive element (name omitted), taken a couple years to develop (Lindeman), not lived up to his hype (Mandeville) or been a solid factor (many bigs). At this juncture, it really doesn’t matter; he’s out of B’town and life goes on here.

Idk. But ogres are like onions.

People didn’t think Stauskas could do it either because of other players in the B1G. We should know by now that a player like LeVert with Beilein can win it.

Loop, I didn’t say IU was “bad” last year, I said the disrespect was a reflection of last year. There are numerous reasons, but I personally think a lot of it was because of the team chemistry, and some coaching. I won’t go into the coaching, but I think the bad chemistry is what made us lose some of those close games, especially the ones where we lost a lead. I can’t quantify what “bad chemistry” does to a team as well as others (Forever could do it 🙂 But it saps a teams energy, it causes them NOT to play as well as a team, and other things you can think of on your own. It’s a bunch of kids playing together that don’t all necessarily like each other. IMO, last years team was not bad, they just played badly together sometimes. I really don’t play the would-of, could-of game that well anyway. LOL

I wish I could give a very rigorous, detailed prediction, but I admit, I’d be BSing. But I believe we have a very deep team that will score a lot of points, with collective stamina that will wear out our opponents. I also feel our team culture is back where it should be, and our guys will find ways to win. I JUST FEEL IT.

Coach K, Calipari, Self. Then Izzo.

That sounds good but upon reflection makes no sense. Last season Indiana lost 9 games by 7 or less and won 5 games by 7 or less. As I review that list we should have (based on talent) lost 1 more game: vs WI at home, and won 5 more games: neutral vs U Conn and ND, away vs IL , home vs PN St and NW. That would make the record 21-11 NOT 17-15. So the loss of Will and Noah is offset by James, Robert, Max, Tim, Jeremiah and Nick, which means that Indiana should have a great season this year. I realize that this requires some thought beyond the obvious IU was bad last year and we know nothing about any new additions beyond James and Robert.

Hey, It’s either coach knight or me. Knight!

In this media crazy world you can’t sneak up on anybody

Hey whats up knight

Hi b_side, this is THE aspect of IU’s play this year that I’m most interested in watching. Honestly, I think that yogi’s #1 issue this year is his play as enabler/distributor versus his desire to be “the” finisher. I think with a 3 guard offense it will be THE reason IU ends up with either W’s or L’s in the conference. While IU’s frontcourt may not be top notch, I think they can “stay in the game” against most big 10 foes and it will be their 3 guards (and TW) that determine the W’s and L’s. We shall see.

Along the weatherman comparison line, ” they’re guessing just like the rest of us are, they’re just getting paid a whole lot better for their guesses. lol

Good post, pretty much where I come down on the whole, can Crean coach or not, thing. Just like he gets to own the rise up out of the ashes, that was done the right way, he also gets to own the shortcomings of the past season whether he wants to or not.

I think their “Blue Ribbon” must be for some other category than college bball predictions, what that is, I have no idea, but I could venture some of the same guesses that just about everybody else could as well.